mhoward
Jul 20 2006, 05:15 PM
QUOTE (hortonheardawho @ Jul 20 2006, 04:35 PM)
Sol 884 looks like a 39 meter move just to the left of the 15 meter circular black dune. I thought it was a crater.
We're just to the northeast of the dark feature - see here:
here.
algorimancer
Jul 20 2006, 05:48 PM
QUOTE (hortonheardawho @ Jul 20 2006, 10:41 AM)
Hi Algorimancer.
Just wanted to thank you for your wonderful parallax tool AlgorimancerPG. I used it exclusively for the parallax measurments in my sol 883 position estimation.
...
FYI, I remeasured several rocks after I refined the direction of motion and got a movement of 37.2 +/- 1 meters on a heading of 7.9 degrees right of center of the reference crater. Didn't make much difference in the original guess. The biggest error source is the center of the 10 meter reference crater.
Hi Horton,
I'm always happy to see AlgorimancerPG in use, and I appreciate the positive feedback. You must be better at feature recognition than I am... I spent much of last evening trying to get a decent fix, with only moderate success; I was only able to identify a few distinct features with confidence. I think my best guess was something like 39 +/-1.5 meters, and I wasn't paying attention to direction, but I'm happy to see it agrees pretty well with your result. I suppose that the point is moot now since we've already moved on, and there seems little debate (now) as to our current (surprising) position up against West Hillock; in fact, 884 is probably going to be one of the best position fixes we've had.
jamescanvin
Jul 21 2006, 12:11 AM
I still don't understand the reason for using the least accurate point on the map (the last position) as your primary reference when there are so many other real features around that can be seen both on the map and in the images. Furthermore I don't understand why you would rather use sub-degree angle changes between two cameras 20cm apart when you can use angles of 100's of degrees between features seen on the ground. Back in the badlands when there was nothing around that was exactly what we were doing, and when we get out onto Victoria's apron it may be the right thing to do again. But here, in possibly the most feature rich area in rover history, it makes no sense.
If the 883 point was 7m further south the features just do not fit, hence that position must be wrong wrt the MOC image, end of story. It doesn't matter how far we drove on that sol, that's not what the map shows, it just shows a sequence of rover positions wrt the MOC image.
Anyway, moving on to 884 - I hope we all agree on this position.
Click to view attachment Fairly obvious - but I've double checked the bearings to the features around just to be sure.
James
algorimancer
Jul 21 2006, 12:52 AM
QUOTE (jamescanvin @ Jul 20 2006, 07:11 PM)
...
Anyway, moving on to 884 - I hope we all agree on this position.
...
Fairly obvious - but I've double checked the bearings to the features around just to be sure.
James
I believe!
In my case, my bag of tricks for position finding depends upon reasonably good distance measurements common to both starting and ending positions, for at least one object, as well as angle measurements to that object from each position which can be be synchronized with the map view. Also, I'm new to the game, but figured that someone ought to step up to the plate while Tesheiner was on vacation. Fun
Anyway, you've picked exactly the spot I would have this time.
mhoward
Jul 21 2006, 12:55 AM
QUOTE (jamescanvin @ Jul 21 2006, 12:11 AM)
Anyway, moving on to 884 - I hope we all agree on this position.
One of the least-debatable positions in recent memory, IMHO. At least for this rover.
jamescanvin
Jul 21 2006, 09:43 PM
Route map updated to sol 885 - Small (2.6m according to the tracking database) drive for weekend IDD work on "West Hillock"
hortonheardawho
Jul 21 2006, 10:45 PM
QUOTE (jamescanvin @ Jul 21 2006, 05:43 PM)
Route map updated to sol 885 - Small (2.6m according to the tracking database) drive for weekend IDD work on "West Hillock"
super 3D of Beagle from sol 884-885 movement:
I used this image and a parallax measurment on sol 884 to calculate a 2.8 meter movement towards Beagle.
The technique uses the change in angular size of features plus a single distance measurment.
The features were 14.5 meters and 6.59 degrees wide on sol 884 and 8.13 degrees wide on sol 885.
hortonheardawho
Jul 21 2006, 11:20 PM
Ooops:
Got Before and after mixed up in the super 3D image. The 14.5 meter measurment is to the 4.06 degree before size and the 3.29 degree is the after size. The recalculation puts Oppy 3.4 meters further away from Beagle.
I was really puzzled by the sol 885 navcams of West Hillock. They look closer -- so I measured and sure enough, Oppy was 3.1 meters closer! So I went back and looked at the super 3D...
Sorry about that.
Toma B
Jul 27 2006, 12:04 PM
After 6 days we are continuing drive toward Beagle Crater...today is drive sol.
QUOTE
Sol Seq.Ver ETH ESF EDN EFF ERP Tot Description
--- -------- --- --- --- --- --- ---- -----------
891 p1151.04 2 0 0 2 0 4 front_hazcam_idd_unstow_doc
891 p1154.01 2 0 0 2 0 4 front_hazcam_idd_unstow_doc
891 p1205.08 2 0 0 2 0 4 front_haz_penultimate_0.5_bpp_pri17
891 p1214.05 2 0 0 2 0 4 front_haz_ultimate_4bpp_pri15
891 p1275.01 2 0 0 2 0 4 front_hazcam_0.5bpp_pri_41
891 p1305.07 2 0 0 2 0 4 rear_haz_penultimate_0.5bpp_pri17
891 p1311.07 2 0 0 2 0 4 rear_haz_ultimate_1_bpp_crit15
891 p1375.01 2 0 0 2 0 4 rear_hazcam_0.5bpp_pri_41
891 p1375.01 2 0 0 2 0 4 rear_hazcam_0.5bpp_pri_41
891 p1585.00 4 0 4 0 0 8 navcam_cloud_4x1_dwnsmp_RVRAz_calstart
891 p1824.01 10 0 0 10 0 20 navcam_5x1_az_234_1_bpp_pri29
891 p1825.01 10 0 0 10 0 20 navcam_5x1_az_54_3_bpp_pri_29
891 p2111.05 13 13 0 0 2 28 pancam_cal_targ_L234567Rall
891 p2352.08 12 0 0 12 2 26 pancam_drive_direction_L2R2
891 p2556.16 13 0 0 13 2 28 pancam_scuff_jesse_chisholm_L234567Rall
891 p2600.09 2 2 0 0 2 6 pancam_tau
891 Total 82 15 4 63 8 172
antoniseb
Jul 27 2006, 12:15 PM
I'm sure it has been explained somewhere, but after a quick look I didn't find it. Can someone please tell me what Sol Seq.Ver ETH ESF EDN EFF ERP Tot all mean? (OK, the first one is pretty obvious, and the 8th one is clearly the total of all the 3rd through 7th ones), but this seems to only be camera requests, and I don't understand how you make out that this makes it a drive day. Does it contain instructions on where to drive to? or how far to turn the wheels? If not perhaps there is another set of commands that we could see. I'd be interested in knowing how we tell these rovers to move.
Phil Stooke
Jul 27 2006, 12:33 PM
It's the penultimate and ultimate hazcam images, and pancam images of the next drive direction that give it away.
Phil
Toma B
Jul 27 2006, 01:29 PM
QUOTE (antoniseb @ Jul 27 2006, 02:15 PM)
I don't understand how you make out that this makes it a drive day.
QUOTE
891 p2352.08 12 0 0 12 2 26 pancam_drive_direction_L2R2
They do this kind of imaging only after a drive...
djellison
Jul 27 2006, 01:41 PM
I'll start a thread for PC Database related stuff somewhere
climber
Jul 27 2006, 05:03 PM
Sometime, it's nice to sit and look some stats.
Oppy left Erebus on March 13th and is now approching Beagle and VC's apron. As on July 16th and since March 13th.
Drive : 1799 m = 3 times the designated distance for mission success
Sols : 117 = 1.3 time the designated life for mission success
... and all this started 2 years after landing.
jamescanvin
Jul 28 2006, 03:04 AM
Without many of the navcams ploting the 891 position is tricky.
But using the tracking database, the size and bearing to Beagle and some parallax to Beagle, here is my best guess - should be fairly close I hope.
Click to view attachment I won't have time to do tomorrowsols drive (Saturday late morning here in Oz, and I have visitors to show around) But hopefully we'll be right of Beagles rim anyway.
James
Phil Stooke
Jul 28 2006, 03:17 AM
I had it at almost the same place, maybe one red dot diameter SW of yours, James.
Phil
abalone
Jul 28 2006, 11:22 AM
Finally here
dvandorn
Jul 29 2006, 05:08 AM
Well -- not quite there yet. I thought we decided that the "official" arrival sol at a given crater was the sol on which the pancam can see down to the center-bottom of the crater floor...
-the other Doug
mhoward
Jul 29 2006, 09:16 PM
QUOTE (jamescanvin @ Jul 28 2006, 03:04 AM)
But using the tracking database, the size and bearing to Beagle and some parallax to Beagle, here is my best guess - should be fairly close I hope.
Now that the rest of the Navcams have come down, I'd say you got it pretty much bang-on, James.
Tesheiner
Jul 29 2006, 09:43 PM
Glad to see the rover almost at Beagle Crater.
No, I'm not "back to business" yet, just making a quick post from the camping's internet shop.
RNeuhaus
Jul 31 2006, 07:41 PM
Now opportunity is sitting about 25 meters (82 feet) from the rim of Beagle Crater.
I have just checked the MER Pancam Data Tracking Web Interface, neither today and tomorrow are driven days.
Rodolfo
dot.dk
Aug 1 2006, 12:31 AM
QUOTE (RNeuhaus @ Jul 31 2006, 09:41 PM)
I have just checked the MER Pancam Data Tracking Web Interface, neither today and tomorrow are driven days.
Now Tomorrow is
CODE
896 p0666.03 0 0 0 0 0 0 navcam_6x1_az_108_3_bpp
896 p1151.04 0 0 0 0 0 0 front_hazcam_idd_unstow_doc
896 p1154.01 0 0 0 0 0 0 front_hazcam_idd_unstow_doc
896 p1205.08 0 0 0 0 0 0 front_haz_penultimate_0.5_bpp_pri17
896 p1212.09 0 0 0 0 0 0 front_haz_ultimate_2_bpp_pri15
896 p1305.07 0 0 0 0 0 0 rear_haz_penultimate_0.5bpp_pri17
896 p1311.07 0 0 0 0 0 0 rear_haz_ultimate_1_bpp_crit15
896 p1375.01 0 0 0 0 0 0 rear_hazcam_0.5bpp_pri_41
896 p1585.00 0 0 0 0 0 0 navcam_cloud_4x1_dwnsmp_RVRAz_calstart
896 Total 0 0 0 0 0 0
CosmicRocker
Aug 1 2006, 05:00 AM
climber
Aug 1 2006, 05:50 PM
200.000 hits on this topic...but only a month to go before it'll be over (on sol 935
)
Holder of the Two Leashes
Aug 1 2006, 07:49 PM
QUOTE (climber @ Aug 1 2006, 12:50 PM)
200.000 hits on this topic...but only a month to go before it'll be over
Not until the wheels break off.
akuo
Aug 1 2006, 08:04 PM
Over how? Manouvering around Victoria is going to be a major task. The best slopes for sun bathing are on the other side of the crater, and that's at least 1250m driving around half of the crater. If they decide to go inside the crater elsewhere, i doubt the best parts are at the first spot we arrive in.
So it's lots more route maps to draw, I reckon.
climber
Aug 1 2006, 08:59 PM
Oups! I thought I was in "going South to Victoria" !!!
So, YES, I expect much more Route Maps
. Even Tesheiner is having vacations so he'll be able to track Oppy for another year and more.
dshaffer
Aug 1 2006, 09:56 PM
QUOTE (akuo @ Aug 1 2006, 03:04 PM)
Over how? Manouvering around Victoria is going to be a major task. The best slopes for sun bathing are on the other side of the crater, and that's at least 1250m driving around half of the crater. If they decide to go inside the crater elsewhere, i doubt the best parts are at the first spot we arrive in.
So it's lots more route maps to draw, I reckon.
By the time opportunity reaches victoria rim, the deep of winter will be over - so no more need to achieve sun-facing slopes.
RNeuhaus
Aug 1 2006, 10:57 PM
QUOTE (dot.dk @ Jul 31 2006, 07:31 PM)
Now Tomorrow is
CODE
896 p0666.03 0 0 0 0 0 0 navcam_6x1_az_108_3_bpp
896 p1151.04 0 0 0 0 0 0 front_hazcam_idd_unstow_doc
896 p1154.01 0 0 0 0 0 0 front_hazcam_idd_unstow_doc
896 p1205.08 0 0 0 0 0 0 front_haz_penultimate_0.5_bpp_pri17
896 p1212.09 0 0 0 0 0 0 front_haz_ultimate_2_bpp_pri15
896 p1305.07 0 0 0 0 0 0 rear_haz_penultimate_0.5bpp_pri17
896 p1311.07 0 0 0 0 0 0 rear_haz_ultimate_1_bpp_crit15
896 p1375.01 0 0 0 0 0 0 rear_hazcam_0.5bpp_pri_41
896 p1585.00 0 0 0 0 0 0 navcam_cloud_4x1_dwnsmp_RVRAz_calstart
896 Total 0 0 0 0 0 0
Good
By that time, when I checked it was blank!!
The navigation direction would be close to South East (108 degrees)? That means Oppy will go toward the southern part of Victoria Crater. No more close up on Beagle Crater.
Rodolfo
Bill Harris
Aug 1 2006, 11:27 PM
QUOTE
The navigation direction would be close to South East (108 degrees)? That means Oppy will go..
No. An azimuth108 degrees is just south of east and goes nowhere immediately useful with respect to Victoria. I'm thinking that she's maneuvering around Beagle, or might possibly be setting up to drive onto the ejecta blanket, AKA their "sand sheet".
Attached is a clip from the Sol 891 Route Map the red arrowed line is at 108 degrees.
--Bill
diane
Aug 1 2006, 11:40 PM
QUOTE (Bill Harris @ Aug 1 2006, 07:27 PM)
No. An azimuth108 degrees is just south of east and goes nowhere immediately useful with respect to Victoria. I'm thinking that she's maneuvering around Beagle, or might possibly be setting up to drive onto the ejecta blanket, AKA their "sand sheet".
My guess is perhaps 10-15 meters in that direction, with a dogleg to the northeast. If they're going to try for a peek into Beagle, that would put the first attempt on the south or southeast side of the crater.
jamescanvin
Aug 1 2006, 11:56 PM
Note that 108 degrees doen't really mean anything useful to the drive direction.
It's the centre azimuth of the navcam pan, but that pan is 6 frames wide thats ~220 degrees. It *may* indicate the direction of Beagle *after* the drive, meaning we're heading toward the west side - but I wouldn't put any money on it from that navcam pointing!
James
jamescanvin
Aug 2 2006, 12:24 AM
Some tracking data is up for 896!
We've gone NE - straight toward Beagle.
About 17m - that should put the rim within 5m or so!!
jamescanvin
Aug 2 2006, 02:42 AM
Route map for Sol 896.
RNeuhaus
Aug 2 2006, 02:25 PM
QUOTE (jamescanvin @ Aug 1 2006, 06:56 PM)
Note that 108 degrees doen't really mean anything useful to the drive direction.
It's the centre azimuth of the navcam pan, but that pan is 6 frames wide thats ~220 degrees. It *may* indicate the direction of Beagle *after* the drive, meaning we're heading toward the west side - but I wouldn't put any money on it from that navcam pointing!
James
James, Good hint!
jamescanvin
Aug 4 2006, 02:49 AM
Sol 898 route map.
Click to view attachmentA short drive to position Oppy nicely on the 7 o'clock ray for IDD work.
P.S I'm escaping from Sydneys winter tomorrow, off to the tropics, so this will be my last route map till the 16th, by which time Tesh should be back anyway.
James
CosmicRocker
Aug 4 2006, 04:39 AM
I hope you have an enjoyable respite, and thanks for expertly filling the void at a time of need.
Sunspot
Aug 4 2006, 11:31 AM
I wonder if they'll drive further to the right/east? on that map - to reach that patch of bedrock before attempting to drive south to Victoria?
Phil Stooke
Aug 4 2006, 05:07 PM
My guess is that Opportunity will head east towards the north rim instead of southeast to the SW rim of Victoria - better tilt and little or no climb involved.
I will keep the map going, since James is off to throw another shrimp on the barbie. Give my regards to Barry McKenzie, James...
Phil
fredk
Aug 4 2006, 07:22 PM
My own guess of the best approach to VC would be directly SE, getting as quickly as possible out of the ripples and onto the apparently smooth "sand sheet". Maybe somebody could start a "what route will they take" poll!
A million thanks, Phil, for taking over the map! If I might offer a suggestion, could you add a few names to the map - in particular the names gamma, delta, epsilon from the route map in
algorimancer's post here. We've used these names a few times already, and if no one has any objections, I suggest using these names until more official names "come down from the mountain". It certainly beats referring to "the closest crater to the south of Beagle" and the like!
Another possibility would be to include the name "Espaņola", from
the latest update, which appears to refer to the "transitional" area between Beagle, Delta, and the southwest extension of the Beagle highway.
Bill Harris
Aug 4 2006, 08:27 PM
I'd go for the naming of names on the Route Map, as long as isn't too cluttered. But as a convention, we ought to put "informal" names in quotation marks and formal names without quotes, ie "Corner Crater" and Beagle Crater.
--Bill
Phil Stooke
Aug 4 2006, 08:34 PM
My map - which has been posted here before in a reduced format - is in a different style. I will not update the other map, I'll post the latest version of mine as I update it.
(edit) - here is the current version of my Opportunity map. I am mapping the route in 500 m square sections, each section will be a separate illustration in a future project. Here I combine the two most recent of them (sections 14 and 15). The grid is labelled in meters from the landing site.
Phil
Click to view attachment
Pavel
Aug 6 2006, 03:29 PM
QUOTE (Phil Stooke @ Aug 4 2006, 04:34 PM)
My map - which has been posted here before in a reduced format - is in a different style. I will not update the other map, I'll post the latest version of mine as I update it.
Beautiful! Thank you, Phil! Looking forward to the updates.
And by the way, can we have Spirit's map in this format, please? You won't need to update it often, in the next few months anyway
Phil Stooke
Aug 6 2006, 04:40 PM
OK, it's over in the Spirit area.
Phil
algorimancer
Aug 8 2006, 01:21 PM
Just FYI, especially for the benefit of the mappers and navigators, I've just posted a major new release of AlgorimancerPG to the "Tech, General and Imagery" section. The new version has the option to incorporate rover and masthead orientation so as to output coordinates in the local topocentric frame, plus has the capability of wide baseline photogrammetry (using images from separate rover locations) to greatly extend the range and accuracy of the results.
gregp1962
Aug 8 2006, 11:16 PM
Wasn't today a drve sol?
RNeuhaus
Aug 9 2006, 01:13 AM
QUOTE (gregp1962 @ Aug 8 2006, 06:16 PM)
Wasn't today a drve sol?
Yes, today at this time ( past 14:00 pm Mars time) Oppy is being tranversing. The most probable driving direction is around 90 degree azimuth (toward to north rim of Victoria Crater).
Rodolfo
djellison
Aug 9 2006, 07:07 AM
QUOTE (RNeuhaus @ Aug 9 2006, 02:13 AM)
The most probable driving direction is around 90 degree azimuth (toward to north rim of Victoria Crater).
There is no suggestion that they are driving to Victoria yet - none at all. There is work to be done at Beagle first.
Doug
dot.dk
Aug 9 2006, 12:40 PM
http://www.newscientistspace.com/article/d...good-shape.htmlQUOTE
On 14 August, Opportunity will start driving towards Victoria crater, which is 800 m across and perhaps 40 m deep. This journey is expected to take about a month.
djellison
Aug 9 2006, 12:51 PM
5 days - sounds like one thorough IDD campaign to me.
Doug
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