My, that's one big, jagged, gaping hole:
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Is there a significant risk of getting stuck if Oppy rolls over one of these rocks?

Wow, will ya look at that...

http://twitpic.com/zysql/full

Are they shattercones littering the area? Or has the rock just fractured at sharp angles? Can't wait to see some of those stones in more detail...

What a pretty big mess we have here...watching at all those rocks and thinking about Stu one image comes to mind...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_3ngcLf0WQ...feature=related

"Are they shattercones littering the area?"

I wouldn't expect shatter cones in a tiny impact like this.

Phil

Fair enough, thanks Phil.

Hmmm. Interesting rock on the bottom of one of the latest images... Wonder if this is what we'll see a lot more of when we get to the crater itself..?

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Sol 2133 navcam panoramic



Yes, we're very near Conception, and we see clearly the "star" structure of the ring of ejectas, I think. And we can see like a dark streak on the horizon Endeavour. Can't wait to have the pancam's

Fourmidable!

And here it is in a polar projection.

Phil

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We are sitting now on one of the most scenic place either rovers ever been on Mars. A fresh 1000 years crater, opening view to our destination, others big craters in sight, Victoria still to find in our rear mirror. We'll be there for a while, guys.
Time to open a new topic. Enjoy your stay.

Many, maybe most of the rocks seem to be sitting on the drifts - very few seem embedded. And there's no sign I can see yet of wind tails behind rocks or moat-like troughs wrapping around the base of rocks (compare with the Barnacle Bill area at Pathfinder to see what I'm referring to). I take that to mean that the drifts have hardly changed since the crater formed. If the drifts were marching across the surface, even 1 cm per year, I would expect to see more buried rocks or wind sculpting of drift around rocks. Pancams might prove me wrong. But I think this shows the big drifts are fairly static on thousand year time scales.

Phil

I'd say no. This is the reverse of the situation Spirit is in where LACK of traction is the problem. Here we have abundant traction. Remember the rovers were designed with an eye toward the only ground observations of Mars we had until that time -- the Viking and Pathfinder sites. And as we all recall those sites consisted of scattered fractured rock as far as the eye could see. It's why they tested the rovers at a site in Death Valley California known as "Mars Hill" (see attached image) which consists of an extreme swath of fractured basalt. This debris field that Opportunity is approaching is ideal for the MERs, however I have no doubt that the approach will be cautious nonetheless.

That's right, and they're pretty small rocks too for the most part.

Phil

Is that the reason this crater is believed to be only about 1,000 years old?

...or that the crater is less than 1000 years old. It's all relative and I have yet to see any data that pins any of the relationships down to an absolute.

What data could Opportunity collect that might help pin the age down? I take it radioisotope ratios are out

Yep, (Frasier Crane voice)... I'm listening...

Some fun for now...

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Exactly. So why are they so certain that it's 1000 years old? Do they have a better crystal ball than me?

Is it me, or do the rocks around the crater even look "fresher"? There aren't any small cobbles around each larger rock, for example.

EGDan, thanks for the info on rock sizes and thank goodness Oppy's rolling on solid ground! I had the pleasure of being tickled by a rover rolling over me at the JPL Open house a few years ago, so I know she can at least climb over a bump-on-a-log my size!

"why are they so certain that it's 1000 years old? "

I wouldn't be overly concerned about this - it's probably just a guess, meaning its preserved ejecta deposit suggests it is most likely very young compared with the other little craters we've seen frequently in the past. Actual number of years - not important. Like when I say I'm 39. Still. Or was it 49?

Phil

Made this HiRise anaglyph of Concepcion, magnified to 200 %. The inside of the crater seems to be completely enshrouded with the dark dust typically filling many smaller Meridiani craters.
Somehow I too have hard time imagining that this crater was just 994 years old when Oppy landed. (Excuse my literal interpretation.)

Stu, cool picture. I think we can see the "ray" of ejecta that goes off to the southeast. With this photo, one really gets the feeling of something having smacked into Mars at a very high velocity.

GREAT 3D overhead view of Concepcion, thanks for posting that!

No big relief differences to expect any significant wind change effects = cleaning events. I would expect some slight effects around Concepción the only "relief" around.
BTW we didn't saw the full deck for quite a while to assess sand deposition. IF we get this 360° panorama we'll probably get more infos on this since the deck is always included.
Globally I'll add that, even if marswiggle 3D is nice, the view from the ground is much better than I was expecting.

OK, thanks Fred, so Bopulu is on Oppy field of view is that correct? Can someone point where to look if the crater was visible?
New pancams are down but no sign of the horizon...or Concepción

We would not want to jam a wheel up again with a potato would we ?

The "potato" jam issues have been caused by small rocks mixed with lots of soft sand that the wheels were buried in. It's always something to watch for, but these environs involve firmer ground. It's difficult to imagine a way of placing a rock inside a wheel cavity unless that wheel is mired in something. As noted previously, this is the kind of terrain the rovers were designed FOR.

edit: sorry, the MI was from sol 2119. I was just hoping they'd find another RAT target here.

Looks like the RAT found another worthy target?
http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportuni...X7P2996M2M1.JPG

Are we in for an mossbauer integration soak now? I presume the goal is to continue measuring the sulfate rocks as we work our way down through the layers.

Is it just me, or are there less and less blueberries as we go?

We've got Hills now, why do you want Blueberries?

Nice Stu, but you're posting in Oppy's

Sorry, posted in haste. Deleted and put in the right place, thanks Climber.

[pedant mode]
Sorry to interrupt the fun, but wasn't the Heat Shield impact the "freshest crater yet explored"?
[/pedant mode]

Carry on, fellas, beautiful images!!

Oooohhh...
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That's a really good anaglyph Fred. It's one of those perfect stereo images that you would include in an oooh-ahhh slide show.

Stu?

That is really cool.



QuickTime VR version (3.2MB)

posthaste?

Quick n dirty 3D portrait of Concepcion... what a fascinating place... Doesn't line up perfectly, I'll try again after work. Apologies in advance for any eye strain...

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And a quick colourised view...

http://twitpic.com/109yn9/full

Ground truth -- could this be the most exquisite example thus far in the history of astronomy?

What a stunning vista in 3D!!!

I know the real science treasures here should be the shallow bedrock that's been presumably tossed up, but definitely want to get a closer look at that terrific pentagonal/home-plate-shaped (from the top) layered rock @ right lower center. Looks like a cake of some kind...tiramisu?

Oh, for just an hour alone with that rock & a geologist's hammer...

Own version of the Sol 2136 pan


YES ! That's a great place to be ! This crater, the two other on the horizon…

What a great view is opening up at the horizon!
I'm 100% sure we'll get some pancams, if not from this exact site, when we stop to start some "sniffing".

Meanwhile, here's a polar view of MHoward's mosaic.
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This one will be as hard to navigate as Bonneville back in 2004 @Gusev

Is it just me or does that ejecta look pretty old (like a lot more than 1000y) and weathered?

Even if this crater appears (relatively) young, its bottom looks like it's covered with dust already.

Seeing this young crater surrounded by shattered boulders, a nagging question comes to my mind. How come we haven't seen a field of boulders around Victoria or Endurance? The formation of these craters must have blasted the bedrock and thrown broken rock all over the place. Where have the boulders gone? Covered with dust? Crumbled to sand?

It's a good question charborob. If you don't mind, I'm going to have a guess before the experts put me right!

(Speculation mode on!)

Firstly, could it be that the impact site is on different ground/bedrock to the other craters you mentioned? Or that the meteorite that struck had a different mineral content?

Secondly, I wonder if the size of impact makes a difference? I am a newbie here so please correct me but I seem to think that Opportunity has passed other similar sized craters with similar rocks strewn around on its recent travels?

Thirdly, I presume erosion does occur on mars and thus if this is a very young crater trying to age it would be of some use to us. I'm unsure if any guesses at the age of victoria and endeavour have been made. (Statto mode on) but if Concepcion is 1,000 years old and those rocks have each lost say 10 cubic centimetre (and that is not a lot) of material then a crater which is 1 million years old will have lost 10,000 cubic centimetres, a crater 1 billion years old will have seen each rock lose 10,000,000 cubic centimetres (10 cubic metres) (Statto mode off)

This is why Concepcion's age could matter. If it is 100 years old or 10,000 years old those figures above change dramatically!

Marquette Island would be different to this as I seem to recall it is a very hard material and hence less likely to erode at a similar rate.

Personally, I suspect a mixture of points 2 and 3.

I must stress I have very little evidence (other than that stated above) to support these views but I just wished to see if I'm beginning to think along the right tracks. I look forward to the class acts on this forum putting me right!

(Speculation mode off)

Neil

Yes, I believe crumbled to sand. They are rather weakly cemented sandstones, and ultimately that's what happens to them. Compare with Bonneville crater at Spirit's landing site, probably at least a billion years old and still surrounded by lots of rocky ejecta, but it's basalt.

My opinion of this location: the rocks hold no interest as we've seen it all before. The interest is in the geomorphology of the crater, for comparison with older craters along the route like Alvin and Viking. That can be taken care of with stereo imaging from 2 or 3 points around it, and then it's time to move on.

Phil

Some more 3D images in my blog post here http://roadtoendeavour.wordpress.com/2010/...ncepcion-crater if anyone wants a look...

Here's a new toy for Stu...
http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportuni...00P2551R1M1.JPG

Thanks for reminding me! I saw that this morning but real life got in the way... Interesting chunka rock, for sure...

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